Grandma never looked so good! The ever-youthful Lucie Arnaz, whose show-business career spans a remarkable 45 years, is currently starring as Berthe, 's no-nonsense, wise and surprisingly nimble grandmother in the hit, Tony-winning, Diane Paulus-directed revival of the musical Pippin at the Music Box Theatre. The singing actress, who is also an Emmy-winning producer (for "Lucy and Desi: A Home Movie"), is playing a limited engagement in the acclaimed revival through Nov. 9, before rejoining the musical's national tour. Arnaz, whose theatrical credits include Broadway's They鈥檙e Playing Our Song (Theatre World, LA Drama Critics and Outer Critics Circle Awards), and as well as the London premiere of The Witches of Eastwick and the national tours of Seesaw, Whose Life Is It Anyway?, Social Security and My One And Only (Sarah Siddons Award), also just directed an industry reading of the new musical Hazel, based on the 60s situation comedy of the same name. I recently had the pleasure of chatting with this multitalented artist, who spoke about her return to the Broadway and national touring stages, her foray into musical theatre directing and her proudest show-biz achievement; that interview follows.
Question: Welcome back to Broadway! How was your first night?
Lucie Arnaz: It was pretty flawless. It was magical. The gods were with us. The routine on the trapeze worked really well. The audience was right with everything I did, and it's a wonderful company, very welcoming, so I felt great at the end of the night.
Question: How did this role originally come about? You started the tour and now you've moved to Broadway鈥�
Lucie Arnaz: I'm still in the tour. This is just a separate little jaunt. Andrea [Martin is] popping into the tour while I pop into Broadway. She wanted to play Los Angeles, and I had a play to direct. I had agreed to direct a 29-hour Equity reading of the new musical Hazel, and that was going to be during these two weeks. And so I thought, "Well, that鈥檚 interesting." [Producer] Barry [Weissler] said, 鈥淗ow would you like to go into the Broadway company during that time while Andrea is in Los Angeles?鈥� 鈥� He originally had asked me to play Broadway, and I didn鈥檛 want to do the Broadway company, mostly because I had just moved. [Husband] Larry [Luckinbill] and I had just moved to Palm Springs. After 37 years on the East Coast, we made a big huge move cross-country. We were just getting settled, and the kids were out of the house, and it was kind of like a second honeymoon for us. We were really enjoying that time together. So it was kind of like, "Oh no, gosh, why is this great part coming now?鈥� But isn鈥檛 that always the way? So he said, 鈥淢aybe you鈥檇 rather do the tour for a while because the tour plays a lot of West Coast cities and maybe that will be easier for you and Larry.鈥� So I thought about it and said, 鈥淵ou know what, it鈥檚 not so much that it鈥檚 the West Coast and it鈥檚 easier, but if I鈥檓 going to go back into a show 鈥� I haven鈥檛 gone into a show from the beginning in a long time, not since I did Witches of Eastwick - and that鈥檚 exciting.鈥� I went into Lost in Yonkers and My One and Only and Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, and you鈥檙e always as a put-in. You鈥檙e rehearsing in a room somewhere with the choreographer and with the stage manager, but you don鈥檛 really get the sense of the company until the day that you鈥檙e 鈥減ut-in鈥� to the show. And, I would say it鈥檚 like being in a Cuisinart on whisk. [Laughs.] Everything鈥檚 flying around you, and it鈥檚 terrifying. So I thought it would be fun to start from scratch with the company, and everybody not knowing what they鈥檙e doing. And that was fun. I loved doing that. Loved being that family again. And, we鈥檝e really just gotten started. We only just opened in Denver, a couple of weeks ago, then we went to San Francisco. We had two weeks in San Francisco. Then came in to the last two weeks in San Francisco while I came here. She鈥檚 going to play LA, and I鈥檓 going to play Broadway, and then I鈥檓 going to rejoin the tour 鈥� happily 鈥� in Orange County, and then go on to parts after that.
Question: When you were approached about the role, were you at all worried about the trapeze aspect?
Lucie Arnaz No. You know what鈥檚 really funny? When I went to see the show in 2013, I was a Tony voter at the time. I remember it was Larry and my anniversary that night, and we went to see Pippin because I鈥檝e always loved that show. It鈥檚 just one of my favorite shows ever, and I was blown away by the whole show. But I remember thinking, when I saw the Berthe character, what it had become, from the original. I thought, 鈥淭hat鈥檚 the best part on Broadway right now!鈥� I said, 鈥淭hey鈥檒l never ask me because I鈥檓 probably too tall.鈥� That was my defense. I thought they were hiring shorter actresses so that they could pretend they were grandmas鈥o when Barry called me, those were the first words out of my mouth. He said, 鈥淗ave you seen our show?鈥� And I said, 鈥淚 love your show, I loved it.鈥� Then he said, 鈥淲e鈥檇 like you to come into Broadway and play Berthe," and I said, 鈥淎ren鈥檛 I too tall?鈥� [Laughs.] He said, 鈥淣o, you鈥檙e not too tall. Don鈥檛 think you鈥檙e too tall!鈥� So my instinct was to talk him out of casting me, which is something crazy that I do sometimes, as the producer cap on me starts to tell the other producers that they shouldn鈥檛 hire me. But some wise part of me slapped some duct tape over my mouth that day and I said, 鈥淥kay.鈥� I thought let鈥檚 take a shot at this because it鈥檚 such a challenging thing to learn how to do that I couldn鈥檛 say no. How, when, where else in your life, at this juncture, are you going to get an opportunity to do something so challenging and to stretch you physically as well as emotionally? And I called a couple of the girls who had played it and said, 鈥淪o, how is this role? How is this company?鈥� And, said, 鈥淟u," she said, "it鈥檚 a fabulous role. Best fun I ever had in my whole career. It鈥檚 like they鈥檙e paying you to get in the best shape you鈥檒l ever be in your life!鈥� And, it鈥檚 totally true, and so I just showed up, went to work and did what they told me to do, followed the process. They鈥檙e basically turning you into an acrobat, and I didn鈥檛 even know how to do a cartwheel. I can鈥檛 do anything, I鈥檓 not that person. But I followed the training: the strength training and the trapeze training, and here we are.
Question: How did you approach the song 鈥淣o Time At All,鈥� which is one of the highlights of the show?
Lucie Arnaz: I agree, I love that song. It鈥檚 such a great lyric. All you have to do is tell the truth. 鈥� Because Stephen Schwartz was 20 when he wrote it, there are two lines that, to me, don鈥檛 jive today. It says, 鈥淲hen you are as old as I my dear and I hope that you never are," which is a funny thing to say when you鈥檙e in your 90s and you鈥檙e talking to somebody else. But then at the end of the trapeze she sings, 鈥淗ow I鈥檝e known the fears of 66 years. And all I want is 67 more.鈥� So I go, "Wait a minute." So - 鈥淲hen you are as old as I my dear 鈥� 66.鈥� And I鈥檓 three years away from that now, and I don鈥檛 feel like I鈥檓 as old as you can possibly get! [Laughs.] Remember when the Beatles wrote, 鈥淲hen I鈥檓 64,鈥� and it was supposed to be, 鈥淲hen I鈥檓 stupid old, will you still feed me? Will you still need me?" Sixty-four! He was forever young when he wrote it, and that seemed old. But the song itself has so many gems of wisdom in it, and I believe I try to live that song in that scene every day. Just live in the moment, stop thinking so much. Look at this day. And he does that, Pippin takes her advice. At the end of the show, he kind of comes back around to where he was in that one simple moment with Grandma. It never was there, it always was here 鈥� meaning, inside. Where is happiness? He was looking for happiness in power and in sex and all the other insanities鈥� The simple life, falling in love, having a kid, living on a farm 鈥� that can鈥檛 be all life is about. It鈥檚 got to be bigger, got to be better. And he comes to say, 鈥淲ell, maybe it鈥檚 not, maybe it鈥檚 not anything more.鈥�
The Berthe character is not just Grandma in that one scene like was [in the original Broadway production]. She comes out and sings the song, and you never see her again. In this incarnation, we鈥檙e a troop of circus players, and so my character is seen as a troop player in the opening. She鈥檚 in the entr鈥檃cte. She鈥檚 in the finale. So, when they鈥檙e trying to get Pippin to do this horrible, dangerous fire thing at the end, what does my character think? We鈥檙e allowed to play any character we want. We create our own characters. Pretty much, it鈥檚 been directed that everybody wants him to jump into the fire, and everyone鈥檚 really disappointed when he doesn鈥檛. But for some reason because I sing that song to him as Granny and have an affinity towards this new Pippin, I can鈥檛 go there. I always get very protective at the end. And, I realize that we are a certain group of players, we鈥檝e been together a long time. I鈥檓 a woman of a certain age, where am I going? I have no family. I鈥檓 sort of an addict to the magic and the theatre, the craziness that we do up there every night. But he doesn鈥檛 have to be. He doesn鈥檛 have to make the choice I made 40 years ago, so I鈥檓 hoping that he won鈥檛. I think there鈥檚 so much depth in this show, and it鈥檚 such a wonderful lesson. It鈥檚 very entertaining, and maybe 60 percent of the audience will leave getting no message at all except, 鈥淥h my God, that was so much fun, and two hours of fun helped me today.鈥� And that鈥檚 good enough. That鈥檚 good enough. But there鈥檚 more and always has been under Pippin, to grab at and learn from.
Question: You mentioned earlier about the Hazel reading. Can you talk a little bit about that project?
Lucie Arnaz: Sure, it鈥檚 a new musical. I love what it鈥檚 called: Hazel, a Musical Maid in America. And my long-time friend and musical director, Ron Abel, is the composer. His partner, Chuck Steffan, is the lyricist, and the book is by Lissa Levin. They have been working together, Ron and Chuck, on various musicals headed to Broadway for years. They both write incredible music. Chuck鈥檚 lyrics are up there with [David] Zippel and [Ira] Gershwin. He鈥檚 one of the smartest lyricists around. And somehow their plays have never gotten to where they needed to go, and I鈥檝e always told them, "It鈥檚 because of the book. You never get a book that鈥檚 strong." There are always tons of problems with the book. And because they鈥檙e not that well known, they don鈥檛 get asked to work on the ones that the big book writers write. This time, they have Lissa. They got the rights to 鈥淗azel,鈥� and she took the story of Hazel and invented it herself. It鈥檚 not like any of the TV shows. It starts before Hazel has the job as the maid; she鈥檚 trying to get the job as the maid, and then she goes to work for the Baxters. If you don鈥檛 know, 鈥淗azel鈥� was a TV show in the sixties based on a cartoon strip of a maid who went to work for the Baxter family, and she basically ran their lives. It was very popular in the sixties. There鈥檚 a lot of it on Youtube. was Hazel and Don DeFore [played George Baxter].
This is a good book, and they have written some spectacular music. I鈥檝e sort of been their muse as they鈥檝e been putting it together and reading things and maybe commenting here and there, going, 鈥淟ook, maybe it鈥檚 better if you go this way.鈥� And they were talking to another actress, who I won鈥檛 say who it is, they probably don鈥檛 want me to, who was very interested [in playing the lead role] and then decided, 鈥淚 don鈥檛 think I have the energy to do another show from scratch. I don鈥檛 think I want to do this.鈥� And I suggested they go to Klea Blackhurst. Klea 鈥� I don鈥檛 know why more people don鈥檛 know who she is, but she has a voice to die for. She is so perfect for this role. I said, 鈥淛ust get her to do the demo. You need a demo of your songs you鈥檙e going to take to producers. At least let her voice be the Hazel voice because she will sell it for you.鈥� So they did, they hired Klea, and then they started talking to producers who said, 鈥淲ho do you have for Hazel?鈥� And they said it鈥檚 not a big name star鈥� but they couldn鈥檛 find anybody nearly as good as her, so they said, 鈥淟ucie, we鈥檙e going to stick with what you said. We鈥檙e going to throw caution to the wind, and we鈥檙e going with Klea. She鈥檚 going to be the one to play it.鈥� And I went, 鈥淵es! I鈥檓 so proud of you guys. That鈥檚 great! That鈥檚 fantastic! This is going to work.鈥� And then, while we were working together, Ron turned to me one day and he said, 鈥淲e鈥檇 like to ask you to direct a 29-hour Equity reading, the first reading of Hazel.鈥� And I said, 鈥淲hat? Are you serious? I鈥檝e only directed a couple of little things.鈥� And he said, 鈥淣o, no, we love the sensibility that you have about the project, and we think you鈥檇 do a great job." It's only a reading. I can鈥檛 even stage it really. You鈥檙e not allowed to use props or choreography. You sing the songs, act your part honestly and put the script over. You know, it鈥檚 funny, the day that they asked me to do that was the same day that called me to go on to Pippin.
Question: So, it was a good day?
Lucie Arnaz: Well, yeah, in a way, but I thought, 鈥淣ow, how am I going to do the reading?鈥� But it all turned out fine, all the calendar dates danced together, and suddenly we were all doing everything. So I鈥檓 doing this, promoting Pippin, working like a lunatic. I鈥檓 going to take a little nap after doing the "Good Day New York" show. Two minutes after I talk to you, I鈥檓 going to lie down a little bit, take a little a nap. Then I鈥檓 going to work with team Hazel before I go down to the theatre and do Pippin. [Laughs.] And, after this next week, that鈥檚 when we start with the actors, I鈥檒l work during the day whenever I don鈥檛 have a matinee. We鈥檒l do our reading on Thursday and Friday. [Readings were held Oct. 24-25 at the June Havoc Theatre.]
Question: When you think about your theatrical experiences, do have a favorite? Is there one that sticks out in your mind?
Lucie Arnaz: Right now, I swear to you, it鈥檚 not just because I鈥檓 being interviewed and you鈥檙e asking me about that鈥 used to say it was learning the tap dances in My One and Only because it was such a challenge, and I felt like I鈥檇 really accomplished something amazing. I never thought I鈥檇 be able to dance with to that extent and those ten minutes tap numbers and pull it off. I was so proud of myself. And, now I鈥檇 have to say Pippin! [Laughs.] I鈥檓 thrilled to be doing this part. It鈥檚 a very special part, a very special moment in that show, and it鈥檚 something that I鈥檇 never thought I鈥檇 get the chance to learn how to do in my life. I鈥檓 in a very good place right now with all of this. There have been so many good shows that it鈥檚 hard to say. Lost in Yonkers was such a thrilling, wonderfully funny, emotional dark piece. They鈥檙e Playing Our Song was my first time on Broadway, which had its own special stuff, and , how could it get better than that? Dirty Rotten Scoundrels was pure fun. One scene on the balcony with Greg Jbara was better than sex! Every Broadway show that I鈥檝e done has had something magnificent about it that you remember. You鈥檙e in love with the baby that you鈥檙e having at the moment.
Question: A couple of weeks ago, I was flicking the channels, and I think it was on MeTV that they were running repeats of 鈥淗ere鈥檚 Lucy.鈥� What鈥檚 it like for you if you happen upon an old episode and you see yourself at that age and with your family?
Lucie Arnaz : I love watching it. I love watching it. It was so long ago, and I was so young; some of those things, I barely remember doing. I totally forgot I did that! It spurs all these other memories that come up and remind me of what I was doing then and what my life was like then. I鈥檓 thinking about writing and doing some significant amount of writing. It鈥檚 hard to get the time 鈥� that's how I鈥檓 researching my own life. 鈥� It helps to go back and see those. It鈥檚 a sense memory. Plus, I鈥檓 very proud, again, of the fact that we did so many musicals. We did six seasons, and every season we did something like five to seven full-fledged musicals as part of the show. That just didn鈥檛 happen in those days. We were way ahead of the curb. We were the 鈥淕lee鈥� of our time. [Laughs.] I think it鈥檚 great. You kind of laugh at the wardrobe because it was the seventies. It was a great time in my life, great training, and then all of the guest stars that we worked with. Fun to look at it now, and we own that show. It鈥檚 the only one that we do own 鈥� my brother and I still own the rights to 鈥淗ere鈥檚 Lucy.鈥� So I鈥檓 glad it鈥檚 being re-run! [Laughs.]
Question: You鈥檝e done so much in so many different mediums. When you look back at your career to this point, is there something that you鈥檙e proudest of?
Lucie Arnaz: I guess I鈥檓 thrilled that I took the time out of my life and stopped what I was doing long enough to do the interviews and put the story together to do the documentary that I did on my mom and dad, 鈥淟ucy and Desi: A Home Movie.鈥� I had no previous experience in doing documentaries, but there was a calling, there was something in my soul saying, 鈥淵ou鈥檝e got to do this. You have to figure out how to do this, and you鈥檝e go to do it now while these people are still alive.鈥� And I spent over three years of my life gathering information and interviewing people on film, and I had no clue what I was going to do with all of that. But then when it sort of formulated itself 鈥� and at the time I was doing Lost in Yonkers on Broadway 鈥� I was editing the transcripts of interviews, and then we took it to NBC and then we started editing on tape. It was a fascinating experience, but more than making a film that turned out well鈥� it was such a cathartic growing up, for me, emotionally. You walk a mile in your folks鈥� shoes, from the time they鈥檙e born to every decision they had to make in their life. You talk to people who knew them, lived with them, grew up with them. It really does help you as your own person. It allows you to dust off any of the little things you carried on your shoulder about, 鈥淚 wish I鈥檇 done鈥� or 鈥淚 wish I鈥檇 had more鈥� or鈥ou go, 鈥淵ou know what? If I was in their positions, knowing only just what they knew then and having those choices between this choice or this choice, I would have done the same thing.鈥� It鈥檚 a very forgiving, cathartic, "wake-up call," and I think everybody should do it about their family, whether they鈥檙e known or not. It was imperative that I do it. It was something that I couldn鈥檛 not do. I鈥檓 not sure where it came from, but it was a great thing to have done.
摆痴颈蝉颈迟听.]
* Well, that's all for now. Happy diva-watching! E-mail questions or comments to [email protected].
Diva Talk runs every other week on 半岛体育.com. Senior editor Andrew Gans also pens the weekly columns Their Favorite Things and Stage Views.
